How is it that the Catholic Church is evil?

Amo2 · Sunday at 8:48 PM

What I found was those who use the Bible to oppose the Catholic Church and their experiences of her, but no one ever says what Catholic teachings are wrong and the Biblical evidence to support them

If this is truly what you desire, I would be glad to show you from scripture, where the Roman Catholic church errs. Nevertheless, if this will just offend you, then perhaps it is not a good idea.

DaveM · Sunday at 9:13 PM

boughtwithaprice said:
How do you know that you are not on the wrong path?

I have born again, I am new creature, when I look back at my life I see someone who has been set free from the enslavement of sin by the power of the HOly spirit

DaveM · Sunday at 9:17 PM

call no man father, is what the bible teachers in context to religious leaders who are trying to elevate themselves, what do Catholics do?

one mediator between man and God Jesus Christ what do Catholics do, pray to marry.

no repetition in prayer meaningless, what do Catholics do have a rosery bead to help keep count of meaningless prayer over prayer to a person who is not our mediator Mary

I could go on and on how scripture refutes the teaching of catholics, believe me it was very hard choice to leave, but Gods word over mans word every time

Valletta · Monday at 1:09 AM

Amo2 said:
If this is truly what you desire, I would be glad to show you from scripture, where the Roman Catholic church errs. Nevertheless, if this will just offend you, then perhaps it is not a good idea.

In fact when the Catholic Church was in the process of choosing the 73 books of the Bible any text that contradicted Catholic teaching was rejected. The Bible is the book of the Catholic Church.

Valletta · Monday at 1:16 AM

DaveM said:
call no man father, is what the bible teachers in context to religious leaders who are trying to elevate themselves, what do Catholics do?

one mediator between man and God Jesus Christ what do Catholics do, pray to marry.

no repetition in prayer meaningless, what do Catholics do have a rosery bead to help keep count of meaningless prayer over prayer to a person who is not our mediator Mary

I could go on and on how scripture refutes the teaching of catholics, believe me it was very hard choice to leave, but Gods word over mans word every time

You simply misinterpret. In fact both Abraham and Paul are referred to in the Bible as spiritual "fathers. " Likewise you misinterpret repetition, if you knew your Bible you would know that Jesus, in agony in the garden, repeated the same prayer to His Father three times. The passage which I believe you are thinking of referred to the pagans, who just went on and on in their prayers trying different words that they believed, if they got the right word, would give them power over idols. As to the rosary, it is focusing on meditating on the mysteries of our faith, such as the Ascension of Jesus into Heaven, the Baptism of our Lord, etc. It is very much praying the Bible. What have you got against praying the Bible?

NewLifeInChristJesus · Monday at 7:39 AM

boughtwithaprice said:
That still does not answer as to how you tell it is the Holy Spirt to whom you are listening, rather than a deceitful spirit disguised as an angel of light. How do you know?
Is it feelings? This way just seems right to me, other people have told me and I believe them?
You do know that scripture says that there is a way that seems right to a man, but the end thereof are the ways of death.

How do you know that you are not on the wrong path?

Because I have an intimate personal relationship with Him and as a result I know His voice.

“Most assuredly, I say to you, he who does not enter the sheepfold by the door, but climbs up some other way, the same is a thief and a robber. But he who enters by the door is the shepherd of the sheep. To him the doorkeeper opens, and the sheep hear his voice; and he calls his own sheep by name and leads them out. And when he brings out his own sheep, he goes before them; and the sheep follow him, for they know his voice. Yet they will by no means follow a stranger, but will flee from him, for they do not know the voice of strangers.” (Jn 10:1–5)

Isn't it part of Catholic doctrine that we must trust the Lord when He speaks to us from the intimacy of our own hearts?

boughtwithaprice · Monday at 9:32 AM

Amo2 said:
If this is truly what you desire, I would be glad to show you from scripture, where the Roman Catholic church errs. Nevertheless, if this will just offend you, then perhaps it is not a good idea.

You can’t offend me. I accept the offense of the cross. I do not wish to offend you, but I will talk of truth

boughtwithaprice · Monday at 9:38 AM

DaveM said:
I have born again, I am new creature, when I look back at my life I see someone who has been set free from the enslavement of sin by the power of the HOly spirit

So you don’t sin anymore. That is wonderful. What standard do you use to judge sin and that you are not in it?
How has your conscience been formed, and do you contemplate an examination of conscience ?

boughtwithaprice · Monday at 9:51 AM

NewLifeInChristJesus said:
Because I have an intimate personal relationship with Him and as a result I know His voice.

“Most assuredly, I say to you, he who does not enter the sheepfold by the door, but climbs up some other way, the same is a thief and a robber. But he who enters by the door is the shepherd of the sheep. To him the doorkeeper opens, and the sheep hear his voice; and he calls his own sheep by name and leads them out. And when he brings out his own sheep, he goes before them; and the sheep follow him, for they know his voice. Yet they will by no means follow a stranger, but will flee from him, for they do not know the voice of strangers.” (Jn 10:1–5)

Isn't it part of Catholic doctrine that we must trust the Lord when He speaks to us from the intimacy of our own hearts?

We trust the Lord, but also believe scripture when it tells us to test the spirits to see whether they are from God. We do not rely solely on our emotions as Satan has the power to manipulate them. That is how he tempts. He makes sin look good and feel good.
The Church gives us objective standards for us to measure. When Christ first calls us, he tells us to deny our very self. Are we in self denial or do we chase feel good spiritual feelings?
Scripture say the time is coming when people will no longer endure sound doctrine, but will heap up teachers to tell them what their itching ears want to hear.
People want to hear that they are good and don’t have to do anything or practice self denial. They want to be told they are a good person. As in the Church in Laodicea they say they are wealthy well fed and have need of nothing, yet God says they are miserable blind poor and naked. He then charges them do buy of Him gold tried in the fire. Have you bought that gold? Do you even know what it is?
Remember, God says I desire obedience rather than sacrifice. Who do you obey?

NewLifeInChristJesus · Monday at 1:39 PM

boughtwithaprice said:
We trust the Lord, but also believe scripture when it tells us to test the spirits to see whether they are from God. We do not rely solely on our emotions as Satan has the power to manipulate them. That is how he tempts. He makes sin look good and feel good.
The Church gives us objective standards for us to measure. When Christ first calls us, he tells us to deny our very self. Are we in self denial or do we chase feel good spiritual feelings?
Scripture say the time is coming when people will no longer endure sound doctrine, but will heap up teachers to tell them what their itching ears want to hear.
People want to hear that they are good and don’t have to do anything or practice self denial. They want to be told they are a good person. As in the Church in Laodicea they say they are wealthy well fed and have need of nothing, yet God says they are miserable blind poor and naked. He then charges them do buy of Him gold tried in the fire. Have you bought that gold? Do you even know what it is?

Well, I don't know exactly what to tell you. Jesus said His sheep hear His voice and follow Him. He also said His sheep don't recognize the voice of strangers and don't follow them. I don't know how this equates to following emotions, feelings, and evil spirits or following false doctrine.

And yes, I have pure white clothes and riches beyond measure. But I didn't have to pay for them.

boughtwithaprice said:
Remember, God says I desire obedience rather than sacrifice. Who do you obey?

What verse are you referring to? I remembered these, but not the one you quoted...

Hos 6:6 -- For I desire mercy and not sacrifice, And the knowledge of God more than burnt offerings.

Matt 9:13 -- "But go and learn what this means: ‘I desire mercy and not sacrifice.’ For I did not come to call the righteous, but sinners, to repentance.”

Matt 12:7 -- But if you had known what this means, ‘I desire mercy and not sacrifice,’ you would not have condemned the guiltless.

DaveM · Monday at 3:02 PM

Valletta said:
As to the rosary, it is focusing on meditating on the mysteries of our faith,

there is no faith in Mary, faith is in Jesus, one mediator between man and GOd. there is no other way to the father except through Jesus NOT Mary , my Jesus is not hanging on a cross like the Catholic church put him, he is alive the cave is empty,, , it all about Jesus my king my Lord my savior, NOT mary, not some priest who elevvates themselves. God word is clear, those who knows him know his voice

If you not completely in love with Jesus you do not know him, you are either 100% in or your not in at all, God will not share his glory with Mary !!! or anyone else like the pope.

DaveM · Monday at 3:24 PM

boughtwithaprice said:
So you don’t sin anymore. That is wonderful. What standard do you use to judge sin and that you are not in it?
How has your conscience been formed, and do you contemplate an examination of conscience ?

when we read the word of God and becomes part of us, we can see that when you are born again you no longer practice sin, you are no longer a slave to sin, you now have the power to say no to sin that entrapped you.

I use Gods standard and his word, stumbling is sin and being enslaved in sin are 2 different things do you know the difference???

Valletta · Monday at 7:55 PM

DaveM said:
there is no faith in Mary, faith is in Jesus, one mediator between man and GOd. there is no other way to the father except through Jesus NOT Mary , my Jesus is not hanging on a cross like the Catholic church put him, he is alive the cave is empty,, , it all about Jesus my king my Lord my savior, NOT mary, not some priest who elevvates themselves. God word is clear, those who knows him know his voice

If you not completely in love with Jesus you do not know him, you are either 100% in or your not in at all, God will not share his glory with Mary !!! or anyone else like the pope.

As per the Catechism of the Catholic Church, my highlighting:

480 Jesus Christ is true God and true man, in the unity of his divine person; for this reason he is the one and only mediator between God and men.

Catechism of the Catholic Church

This does not mean the Jesus cannot work through His Apostles and others, He sometimes does. Do not discard the teachings of the Apostles or the rest of the Bible. Jesus is alive, not dead, the crucifix does not represent the current state of Jesus, it is historical in nature and a reminder of the sacrifice of Jesus. Praying the Bible, as we very much do in the rosary, can be beneficial. Remember that as a practicing Jew Jesus, like Catholics, would have prayed Holy Scripture. Praying the Psalms was normal for Jews of His day.

Kathleen30 · Monday at 9:08 PM

Valletta said:
As per the Catechism of the Catholic Church, my highlighting:

480 Jesus Christ is true God and true man, in the unity of his divine person; for this reason he is the one and only mediator between God and men.

Catechism of the Catholic Church

This does not mean the Jesus cannot work through His Apostles and others, He sometimes does. Do not discard the teachings of the Apostles or the rest of the Bible. Jesus is alive, not dead, the crucifix does not represent the current state of Jesus, it is historical in nature and a reminder of the sacrifice of Jesus. Praying the Bible, as we very much do in the rosary, can be beneficial. Remember that as a practicing Jew Jesus, like Catholics, would have prayed Holy Scripture. Praying the Psalms was normal for Jews of His day.

Valletta when you mention the catechism of the Roman Catholic Church concerning the one mediator being Jesus Christ. You then say ( this does not mean that Jesus cannot work through his apostles and others. ) Are you referring to the apostles and others as mediators ? with the power to forgive sin and grant internal life ?

Valletta · Monday at 10:44 PM

Kathleen30 said:
Valletta when you mention the catechism of the Roman Catholic Church concerning the one mediator being Jesus Christ. You then say ( this does not mean that Jesus cannot work through his apostles and others. ) Are you referring to the apostles and others as mediators ? with the power to forgive sin and grant internal life ?

I said "work through." Jesus can accomplish His will as He sees fit. The actual forgiveness of sins comes from Jesus, but Jesus gave the power to forgive sins to the Apostles and their successors to exercise in His name. While the Catholic Church recognizes Jesus as our one unique mediator, we also know the Word of God tells us to pray for one another. Once again Jesus can work through men.

Kathleen30 · Tuesday at 6:25 AM

Valletta said:
I said "work through." Jesus can accomplish His will as He sees fit. The actual forgiveness of sins comes from Jesus, but Jesus gave the power to forgive sins to the Apostles and their successors to exercise in His name. While the Catholic Church recognizes Jesus as our one unique mediator, we also know the Word of God tells us to pray for one another. Once again Jesus can work through men.

Valletta well yes I agree once Gods Spirit rejuvenates our spirit to fellowship with him that brings the entire church is fully alive in him and is used accordingly to whatever his will be for each of us. Yes Jesus certainly works through each of us. You then say your church speaks of Jesus as the UNIQUE meditator. But is Jesus the only mediator within your church ? Or are there other mediators as well ?

Valletta · Tuesday at 12:12 PM

Kathleen30 said:
Valletta well yes I agree once Gods Spirit rejuvenates our spirit to fellowship with him that brings the entire church is fully alive in him and is used accordingly to whatever his will be for each of us. Yes Jesus certainly works through each of us. You then say your church speaks of Jesus as the UNIQUE meditator. But is Jesus the only mediator within your church ? Or are there other mediators as well ?

Think of it like healing. God ultimately heals. Did God ever heal through men? Yes, Jesus sent the Apostles out to heal all diseases. Certainly the Apostles had a role in healing in our Church, that's what I mean by God working through men. It's similar for Jesus as our mediator.

boughtwithaprice · Tuesday at 1:27 PM

DaveM said:
when we read the word of God and becomes part of us, we can see that when you are born again you no longer practice sin, you are no longer a slave to sin, you now have the power to say no to sin that entrapped you.

I use Gods standard and his word, stumbling is sin and being enslaved in sin are 2 different things do you know the difference???

Thank you for taking the time to talk with me. You bring up interesting points of discussion.

Yes there is one mediator, Our Lord Jesus Christ, yet we are the body of Christ. Mary is part of the
Body, the saints are part of the Body, believers are part of the Body. We are all one in Christ Jesus. Do you agree with this?

Being part of the Body, when we pray or ask others to pray, we are praying with Christ and through Christ, not as separate mediators.
Do you understand this or disagree?

Mary is the only one to have Jesus Christ physically growing in her body, flesh of her flesh.
As in Genesis 3:15, God calls Jesus the seed of the woman. God says Satan is the enemy of the woman, not Jesus, but Jesus being the seed of the woman, Satan is naturally His enemy also, but first Satan hates the woman, and he will do anything to crush her, hurt her or eliminate her.
In Revelation 12, we see that Satan tried to drown her after Jesus ascended into heaven
What we have through faith, Mary had and has by sight. She brought forth Jesus into the world from her own flesh, spoke directly with Him and He was subject to her for 30 years, and He also began His ministry at her request. John lept in the womb at the sound of Mary’s voice, it was by and through the power of Jesus, yet scripture tells us it was at the sound of Mary’s voice.

Catholics do not worship Mary as a separate God, we honor her as the promise of God to the world through Adam directly after the fall in Genesis 3:15. We exalt her as the promised enemy of Satan, as anything that would diminish or hide her behind Jesus would be doing Satan’s bidding. We do not say she is above Jesus, rather she is with Jesus. The Hail Mary is taken directly from scripture in Luke chapter 1
Hail Mary, full of grace, the Lord is with you
Blessed are you amongst women and blessed is the fruit of your womb, Jesus

Even if you don’t agree with what I am saying, does anything that I have said contradict scripture? If you say so, then how?

Kathleen30 · Tuesday at 10:30 PM

Valletta said:
Think of it like healing. God ultimately heals. Did God ever heal through men? Yes, Jesus sent the Apostles out to heal all diseases. Certainly the Apostles had a role in healing in our Church, that's what I mean by God working through men. It's similar for Jesus as our mediator.

Yes I fully understand that with the healing powers and the powers to bind and loose from heaven as here upon earth that the apostles had with the commencement of the kingdom of God here on earth which began with Jesus Christ And Yes there are similarities. And we know that we are to forgive each others failings and trespasses But did that ever infer the power to anyone else in having the power to forgive sins other then Jesus Christ as mediator. Or are there other mediators we can go through within the Roman Catholic Church that have the power over life and death more so concerning the power over eternal life ?

boughtwithaprice · Wednesday at 6:02 AM

Kathleen30 said:
Yes I fully understand that with the healing powers and the powers to bind and loose from heaven as here upon earth that the apostles had with the commencement of the kingdom of God here on earth which began with Jesus Christ And Yes there are similarities. And we know that we are to forgive each others failings and trespasses But did that ever infer the power to anyone else in having the power to forgive sins other then Jesus Christ as mediator. Or are there other mediators we can go through within the Roman Catholic Church that have the power over life and death more so concerning the power over eternal life ?

We are many members but one Body, the Body of Christ. The concept does not imply multiple mediators but one. We are all one in the body of Christ Jesus.
The concept that Jesus is the only functioning part of the body would actually destroy the concept of a unified body and turn us into a fractured multi headed mess with all parts contradicting eachother based on personal point of view. That is a concept that Paul vehemently opposed. Is Christ divided? God forbid!
Ephesians 4 explains the concept of the Body, some Apostles, some prophets, some teachers, etc. We do not all have the same gifts and purpose, yet we are to function as one body, that one mediator.
Ephesians 4:17-18 also warns against the individualism that would deny the body. We are not to walk as the gentiles do in the vanity of their minds. We are to walk in humility toward one another, and the Bible tells us to think of all others as better than ourselves, not in an “I don’t need you, only Jesus is my mediator” kind of way
1 Corinthians 12 and Romans 12 further explain the concept of the Body of Christ. We all have different gifts and we all serve eachother. We are not mere individuals claiming Jesus and the Holy Spirit for ourselves only. We humbly submit to one another. We learn from, pray for, heal and encourage one another. We are many members, yet one Body, with one mediator, Jesus Christ.
As far as forgiving sins, you do know that in John 20, Jesus gave that power to His Apostles, right? If He wanted it taught that only He could forgive sins and we should never submit to another man , why would he bestow the power on His Apostles. It is ultimately God alone who forgives sins, but God has ambassadors who are His Apostles.
The Catholic Church perfectly maintains the concept of the Body of Christ. The Pope is the chief Apostle, and apostolic authority is shared in a hierarchy consisting of Cardinals, Arch Bishops and Bishops. The Bishops share their authority with the priests who can also delegate deacons
We also have prophets, doctors of the Church, workers of miracles and teachers who all work together for the perfecting of the saints as exactly described in scripture.
The charge that the Catholic Church is evil because it violates the one mediator clause of scripture is completely false and one would say the idiom “out of left field”. Google who is said to walk the left hand path, and you may identify the deceiving spirit.
Just because we say that we follow Jesus does not mean we cannot be deceived. We avoid deception when we are in humble submission to one another in the one Body of Christ, the Church, which scripture says is the pillar and foundation of truth.

Peace be with you

How is it that the Catholic Church is evil?

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